Sometimes we feel the truth of certain principles and hesitate to share them because they may not be popular or may even be seen as false, or considered heresy. I'm afraid this post fits in that category, but I will go ahead and post it anyway.
I love the story of William Tyndale. He bravely fulfilled his mission to translate the scriptures into English, and make the bible available to every plow boy, and he did it at a time when it conflicted the incorrect though seemingly correct dogmas that existed in the church in those days. He did it knowing it was a heretical endeavor. That is why I admire him, and believe the spirit of God lit a fire deep in his bones that made his fear of God greater than his fear of men.
Now days it would seem foolish to anyone that someone should be excommunicated (let alone, executed) for translating holy writ into another language. There were men in Joseph Smith Jr's day who sought his blood and were eventually victorious. Two wonderful martyrs, defending doctrines that were controversial in their day.
But is that blood seeking spirit gone in modern times? Has all that vanished, and now everyone happily agrees to the theologies of the LDS church? And by 'everyone', I mean within the church. Are there members of the church who would murder our prophet for revealing more information to us? Or perhaps they would execute even the rank and file member who stumbled across a pure and precious truth that conflicted a perhaps dogmatic, cultural precept held among modern church members. I have found a few of those dogmatic views that are not supported scripturaly, and I know I'm not the only one. But just to be clear, these dogmas are held by uninformed members of the church, NOT the formal doctrines of the church itself.
What we Tether Ourselves to
One of these dogmas which is observed more than stated, is that sometimes we lean upon selected principles as our foundation. Principles are subject to change, but doctrines are unchanging. If we ground ourselves on pure doctrines, then we can not fall.
I knew a woman whose testimony was rooted in the prophet Joseph Smith (a good and true principle, not doctrine). Years later when she found out her dear prophet was sealed to many women she left the church. Her foundation crumbled beneath her.
I heard of a catholic woman who said "Even if Jesus Christ himself came down to me and told me my faith was wrong, I would not leave it." This woman also has foundation deficit disorder (FDD - just made that up).
My point in these two illustrations is to suggest that there are better things to tether ourselves to, most importantly of which is the Godhead. The fountain of all righteousness. Nephi, the prophet at the time of the coming of the Savior to the Nephites recognized this truth as he said the following:
Other times, our views of the men who hold sacred offices are impractical; like Symonds Ryder who's name was misspelled by Joseph Smith. Symonds later said that if the “‘Spirit’ through which he had been called to preach could err in the matter of spelling his name, it might have erred in calling him to the ministry as well" (History of the Church, 1:260–61 footnotes, accessed here). We often repeat this story in the church to teach this principle that our mortal prophets are fallible men, who hold sacred offices, but I wonder if we truly have the message.
Bruce R. McConkie said the following on the mortal nature of our prophets:
I love the story of Brigham Young, who one day spoke to the Saints as "Brother Brigham", but came back to them later to speak as "The Prophet" (still looking for this source). It affirms to me that our prophets are humans, and that doesn't in any way limit my desire to follow them. It just means there is room to listen to the spirit as our prophets speak.
Or the story of Joseph Smith playing with children and pulling sticks. I wonder if a new member of the church or a prestigious politician would be offended if President Monson asked them if they wanted to 'wrestle' like Joseph once did (story captured here). I love his down-to-earth human nature!
Finding Truth in Books
I served a mission for the LDS church in 1998 in Cape Town South Africa. One of the more memorable experiences I had was giving a Book of Mormon to a brother and sister in their upper teens. We also left them with the challenge of reading it and praying about it, to which they eagerly agreed. When we came back the following week, we asked how their reading went. The older brother replied, "We threw it in the rubbish bin". I asked why they did that and if they had prayed about it, and he explained that they didn't need to read or pray about it because they knew it was false.
I respect people's right to revelation, but my revelation was that the Book of Mormon was in fact an authentic account of the Savior, translated by prophetic gifts. I know the Lord can tell us immediately things that we should or should not do, but it is my conviction that immediate answers from the Lord without effort are far more rare than common. The scriptures teach that with regard to getting answers from the Lord, we must first study it out in our mind, and then ask if it is right (Doctrine and Covenants 9:8). From this experience I resolved to never blindly dismiss anything until I had properly studied it out and relied on the Holy Ghost for answers.
I know some people who seem to be opposed to reading some books because they do not come from the Deseret Book printing press, or they do not have the church's logo on it. Please understand, I don't say this in mockery because I respect anyone who firmly follows the prophet and whatever limitations they set for doing so; but I do sincerely say that sometimes we tether ourselves to the wrong principles.
My search for truth is based on the doctrine to seek learning out of the best books (Doctrine and Covenants 109:7), which first and foremost includes the scriptures, but to me is broader than that. And actually, I would suggest it is okay to read any book as long as we use the spirit as our guide, or as Moroni said: "And by the power of the Holy Ghost, ye may know the truth of all things", Moroni 10:5.
Commanded in All Things
I preface my next point by saying, I love and sustain the prophet of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. I always have, and I always will. Even if I felt for a moment he was misled, and had lost his favor in God's eyes (something I don't believe would ever happen), I would still sustain, support, and follow him. In fact, I have had two very personal encounters with Thomas S. Monson that I will cherish forever. I have known and seen too much in the church to believe the Lord would lead any other organization - I'm in this church for life!
Now having said that, I add that the Spirit's voice is more important to me than the prophet's. I say this because the prophet does not speak on all things. The prophet did not tell me who to marry, which job I should take, what books to read, or which music or media is appropriate for me and my family. Those roles and numerous others can only be validated by the Holy Ghost.
We have correctly been taught in the church to follow the prophet. I am concerned however that some members extend that principle into a dogmatic view that we should "wait for the prophet to tell you what is true", or "Wait for the prophet to speak before moving to action", etc. Following the prophet is not wrong, I just think it needs to follow the doctrine of taking the Holy Spirit for our guide (Doctrine and Covenants 45:57), or of tethering ourselves to the spirit.
During 1831-33 there were two main church centers: Kirtland, Ohio, and Jackson County, Missouri. Though Jackson County was the "center place" (Doctrine and Covenants 57:3), Kirtland was at that time the main gathering place and is where the Lord wanted Joseph Smith to live. This created some conflict because the saints in Jackson County thought the Lord's prophet should live in the center place.
It is also important to understand at this time that the saints had enjoyed the prophets' close association so much that they would often go to him for every concern, problem, and question they had. It was at this time Joseph received the following revelation:
I love the story of William Tyndale. He bravely fulfilled his mission to translate the scriptures into English, and make the bible available to every plow boy, and he did it at a time when it conflicted the incorrect though seemingly correct dogmas that existed in the church in those days. He did it knowing it was a heretical endeavor. That is why I admire him, and believe the spirit of God lit a fire deep in his bones that made his fear of God greater than his fear of men.
Now days it would seem foolish to anyone that someone should be excommunicated (let alone, executed) for translating holy writ into another language. There were men in Joseph Smith Jr's day who sought his blood and were eventually victorious. Two wonderful martyrs, defending doctrines that were controversial in their day.
But is that blood seeking spirit gone in modern times? Has all that vanished, and now everyone happily agrees to the theologies of the LDS church? And by 'everyone', I mean within the church. Are there members of the church who would murder our prophet for revealing more information to us? Or perhaps they would execute even the rank and file member who stumbled across a pure and precious truth that conflicted a perhaps dogmatic, cultural precept held among modern church members. I have found a few of those dogmatic views that are not supported scripturaly, and I know I'm not the only one. But just to be clear, these dogmas are held by uninformed members of the church, NOT the formal doctrines of the church itself.
What we Tether Ourselves to
One of these dogmas which is observed more than stated, is that sometimes we lean upon selected principles as our foundation. Principles are subject to change, but doctrines are unchanging. If we ground ourselves on pure doctrines, then we can not fall.
I knew a woman whose testimony was rooted in the prophet Joseph Smith (a good and true principle, not doctrine). Years later when she found out her dear prophet was sealed to many women she left the church. Her foundation crumbled beneath her.
I heard of a catholic woman who said "Even if Jesus Christ himself came down to me and told me my faith was wrong, I would not leave it." This woman also has foundation deficit disorder (FDD - just made that up).
My point in these two illustrations is to suggest that there are better things to tether ourselves to, most importantly of which is the Godhead. The fountain of all righteousness. Nephi, the prophet at the time of the coming of the Savior to the Nephites recognized this truth as he said the following:
"...remember that it is upon the rock of our Redeemer, who is Christ, the Son of God, that ye must build your foundation; that when the devil shall send forth his mighty winds, yea, his shafts in the whirlwind, yea, when all his hail and his mighty storm shall beat upon you, it shall have no power over you to drag you down to the gulf of misery and endless wo, because of the rock upon which ye are built, which is a sure foundation, a foundation whereon if men build they cannot fall" (Helaman 5:12).Prophets are Mortal
 |
| Stick Pulling - Deseret News |
Bruce R. McConkie said the following on the mortal nature of our prophets:
“With all their inspiration and greatness, prophets are yet mortal men with imperfections common to mankind in general. They have their opinions and prejudices and are left to work out their problems without inspiration in many instances. Joseph Smith recorded that he ‘visited with a brother and sister from Michigan, who thought that “a prophet is always a prophet”; but I told them that a prophet was a prophet only when he was acting as such’” (Mormon Doctrine, 608; accessed here)I heard a story about our current prophet a number of years ago who was apparently a little snippy with a pharmacist one time as witnessed by a member of the church. I immediately went to the prophets' defense in my mind thinking surely he didn't do that, and then the rational thought came "Yes, it is entirely possible, but it doesn't mean he is a fallen prophet - it means he is a mortal like you". The lesson for me was that I tend to put the personal lives of those men in Salt Lake City on an unrealistically high pedestal. But to be clear, there isn't anything anyone can say that will cause me to question the authority and calling of the brethren, and I am perfectly comfortable following them while knowing they have made some basic mistakes and have their own mortal weaknesses.
I love the story of Brigham Young, who one day spoke to the Saints as "Brother Brigham", but came back to them later to speak as "The Prophet" (still looking for this source). It affirms to me that our prophets are humans, and that doesn't in any way limit my desire to follow them. It just means there is room to listen to the spirit as our prophets speak.
Or the story of Joseph Smith playing with children and pulling sticks. I wonder if a new member of the church or a prestigious politician would be offended if President Monson asked them if they wanted to 'wrestle' like Joseph once did (story captured here). I love his down-to-earth human nature!
Finding Truth in Books
I served a mission for the LDS church in 1998 in Cape Town South Africa. One of the more memorable experiences I had was giving a Book of Mormon to a brother and sister in their upper teens. We also left them with the challenge of reading it and praying about it, to which they eagerly agreed. When we came back the following week, we asked how their reading went. The older brother replied, "We threw it in the rubbish bin". I asked why they did that and if they had prayed about it, and he explained that they didn't need to read or pray about it because they knew it was false.
I respect people's right to revelation, but my revelation was that the Book of Mormon was in fact an authentic account of the Savior, translated by prophetic gifts. I know the Lord can tell us immediately things that we should or should not do, but it is my conviction that immediate answers from the Lord without effort are far more rare than common. The scriptures teach that with regard to getting answers from the Lord, we must first study it out in our mind, and then ask if it is right (Doctrine and Covenants 9:8). From this experience I resolved to never blindly dismiss anything until I had properly studied it out and relied on the Holy Ghost for answers.
I know some people who seem to be opposed to reading some books because they do not come from the Deseret Book printing press, or they do not have the church's logo on it. Please understand, I don't say this in mockery because I respect anyone who firmly follows the prophet and whatever limitations they set for doing so; but I do sincerely say that sometimes we tether ourselves to the wrong principles.
My search for truth is based on the doctrine to seek learning out of the best books (Doctrine and Covenants 109:7), which first and foremost includes the scriptures, but to me is broader than that. And actually, I would suggest it is okay to read any book as long as we use the spirit as our guide, or as Moroni said: "And by the power of the Holy Ghost, ye may know the truth of all things", Moroni 10:5.
Commanded in All Things
I preface my next point by saying, I love and sustain the prophet of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. I always have, and I always will. Even if I felt for a moment he was misled, and had lost his favor in God's eyes (something I don't believe would ever happen), I would still sustain, support, and follow him. In fact, I have had two very personal encounters with Thomas S. Monson that I will cherish forever. I have known and seen too much in the church to believe the Lord would lead any other organization - I'm in this church for life!
Now having said that, I add that the Spirit's voice is more important to me than the prophet's. I say this because the prophet does not speak on all things. The prophet did not tell me who to marry, which job I should take, what books to read, or which music or media is appropriate for me and my family. Those roles and numerous others can only be validated by the Holy Ghost.
We have correctly been taught in the church to follow the prophet. I am concerned however that some members extend that principle into a dogmatic view that we should "wait for the prophet to tell you what is true", or "Wait for the prophet to speak before moving to action", etc. Following the prophet is not wrong, I just think it needs to follow the doctrine of taking the Holy Spirit for our guide (Doctrine and Covenants 45:57), or of tethering ourselves to the spirit.
During 1831-33 there were two main church centers: Kirtland, Ohio, and Jackson County, Missouri. Though Jackson County was the "center place" (Doctrine and Covenants 57:3), Kirtland was at that time the main gathering place and is where the Lord wanted Joseph Smith to live. This created some conflict because the saints in Jackson County thought the Lord's prophet should live in the center place.
It is also important to understand at this time that the saints had enjoyed the prophets' close association so much that they would often go to him for every concern, problem, and question they had. It was at this time Joseph received the following revelation:
"For behold, it is not meet that I should command in all things; for he that is compelled in all things, the same is a slothful and not a wise servant; wherefore he receiveth no reward. Verily I say, men should be anxiously engaged in a good cause, and do many things of their own free will, and bring to pass much righteousness; For the power is in them, wherein they are agents unto themselves. And inasmuch as men do good they shall in nowise lose their reward . But he that doeth not anything until he is commanded... the same is damned (Doctrine and Covenants 58: 26-29)."
It appears that the Lord was trying to wean the Saints off of using the prophet inappropriately, and not to wait on him to be commanded, and more importantly, to help them become agents acting for themselves toward righteous pursuits. Anyone who follows David A. Bednar's ministry knows he is keen on the doctrine of being agents who act, and are not acted upon (2 Nephi 2:26;
Seek Learning by Faith - Ensign Sept. 2007 - ensign).
I believe there are a good many members of the church who are waiting to be compelled by the prophet in all, many, or some things. I am afraid that in so doing, they are losing the promise of a reward that comes with bringing to pass much righteousness and are simultaneously damning their own progression. As a parent some of my greatest moments of happiness are when I see one of my children do something wonderful of their own accord, with no prompting from me.
Seek Learning by Faith - Ensign Sept. 2007 - ensign).
I believe there are a good many members of the church who are waiting to be compelled by the prophet in all, many, or some things. I am afraid that in so doing, they are losing the promise of a reward that comes with bringing to pass much righteousness and are simultaneously damning their own progression. As a parent some of my greatest moments of happiness are when I see one of my children do something wonderful of their own accord, with no prompting from me.
My Testimony
To those who may take some of my written and non-written comments out of context and pin me as a heretic, I invite them to prayerfully study the sources I have provided as evidence to the doctrines presented here. If I am misguided, I would like to know according to scripture, modern revelation through church authorities, or even personal insights. I will take those points to my source of all truth and change what I have written if directed by him.
Lastly, I assure my readers that my testimony and faith in our church leaders is not waning. I follow the prophet to the best of my ability. I pray for him, sustain him, and love him. I will follow him to my death if needed. And I am tethered to him - but only second to the Godhead who is my rock and my foundation.
To those who may take some of my written and non-written comments out of context and pin me as a heretic, I invite them to prayerfully study the sources I have provided as evidence to the doctrines presented here. If I am misguided, I would like to know according to scripture, modern revelation through church authorities, or even personal insights. I will take those points to my source of all truth and change what I have written if directed by him.
Lastly, I assure my readers that my testimony and faith in our church leaders is not waning. I follow the prophet to the best of my ability. I pray for him, sustain him, and love him. I will follow him to my death if needed. And I am tethered to him - but only second to the Godhead who is my rock and my foundation.
"O Lord, I have trusted in thee, and I will trust in thee forever. I will not put my trust in the arm of flesh; for I know that cursed is he that putteth his trust in the arm of flesh. Yea, cursed is he that putteth his trust in man or maketh flesh his arm" (2 Nephi 4:34).
I love your blog. Thanks for sharing this. Here's a few things to also ponder over.
ReplyDeleteWhat is the prophesied (latter-day) 'sin to be even as Sodom' (2 Nephi 13:9)?
Why did Isaiah say that 'women' will 'rule over' men – in the Church (2 Nephi 13:12)?
Why did Isaiah say there would be a 'tail', a 'prophet who teacheth lies', that would emerge in the Church (2 Nephi 19:15-16) – who sounds EXACTLY like Paul's prophesied 'man of sin', that will declare himself to be 'god' in the Temple (JST-2 Thessalonians 2:1-11) – where the Lord said He would start His 'day of burning', 'First among those among you, saith the Lord, who have professed to know my name and have not known me, and have blasphemed against me in the midst of my house, saith the Lord' (D&C 112:23-26)?
Why did God the Father say He would remove His 'gospel' from the 'Gentiles' – IF they 'sin against my gospel' and 'reject the fulness of my gospel' (3 Nephi 16:10)?
Why does the 'sin to be even as Sodom' sound like God the Father's 'sin against my gospel' – with the prophetic 'women rule over' the Church line, from Isaiah, reflecting on God the Father's 'reject the fulness of my gospel' warning?
Why did Nephi plead with us to 'liken' the Isaiah scriptures to ourselves (2 Nephi 11:8)?
Why did Nephi so strongly warn that the devil is the author of, 'All is well in Zion; yea, Zion prospereth, all is well' – while pronouncing 'wo be unto him that is at ease in Zion!', and, 'Wo be unto him that crieth: All is well!'? (2 Nephi 28:21-25)?
Why did Nephi and Mormon both warn about 'a great division among the people' – that will come about in the latter-days – a verbatim line which Mormon used to describe the apostate fall of the people generations after the appearance of the Savior (2 Nephi 30:10; 4 Nephi 24-35)?
If the Book of Mormon was 'written for our day' why did Mormon include this line in 4th Nephi, 'Yea, there were many churches which professed to know the Christ, and yet they did deny the more parts of his gospel, insomuch that they did receive all manner of wickedness, and did administer that which was sacred unto him to whom it had been forbidden because of unworthiness?'
If 'there are save two churches only', and only one of those two churches could ever be called the 'holy church of God', then why did Moroni say this, 'O ye pollutions, ye hypocrites, ye teachers, who sell yourselves for that which will canker, why have ye polluted the holy church of God? Why are ye ashamed to take upon you the name of Christ? Why do ye not think that greater is the value of an endless happiness than that misery which never dies--because of the praise of the world' (Mormon 8:38)?
Why did Presidents Ezra Taft Benson and Gordon B. Hinckley say that the Book of Mormon was 'written for our day'; should be 'read like the morning newspaper'; and that we should ask ourselves why 'every line' of the Book of Mormon is in there?
Marco, your questions and research are fantastic! I have to admit, it's going to take me some time to go through it. Thanks for sharing, and thanks for taking the gospel seriously!! 😊
ReplyDeleteMarco, the answer to several of your questions lies in the fact that the Church was prophesied to go out of order prior to the Lord's Second Coming. Everything that Joseph restored has to be restored again, so that there is a people on the earth willing to live ALL of the Lord's commandments. So what we are waiting for now is the cleanse of the church.
ReplyDeletewww.millennialNorthStar.info
Eric - it may be possible with reference to Brigham Young "the man" verses "the prophet" was during the Mountain Meadow Massacre. He openly made negative comments, then later he sent word that the people were to pass in peace.
ReplyDelete